Are you funding the Border wall or ladders? THREAD CLOSED BY CK1942

[Goofy11]

I

Please tell me what your link has to do with the links I posted showing that the cartels have built tunnels to smuggle whatever they want into the U.S?
Hypothetically, do you think if the Wall gets built that the cartels are going to say: “that’s it we are done - there’s no way our drugs are getting through?”
You are turning this into a liberal vs conservative battle which I am not going in that direction. Both sides have good and bad ideas but you are obviously 100 percent conservative - I could easily post 100’s of links of falsehoods on Fox News.

However, answer the question how will a wall stop the cartels if they are smuggling items underground ?

The wall by itself will not and can not stop every assault that the wealthy cartels will throw at it. Be it tunnels, explosives, elaborate laddering schemes...but it will deter the thousands to tens of thousands who can, and are freely and simply walking across the border. The walls in San Diego and El Paso and a few other places are stopping 90% of illegal crossing. Heck CNN’s Acusta pointed that out just the other day with video showing how well the wall was working. Really couldn’t have said it better myself. Many of the tunnels have been found and stopped and a lot of those tunnels before they were completed. If we can take a huge work load off the border patrol workers from dealing with thousands upon thousands simply walking across they can refocus and seek out the tunnels. Still probably won’t be 100% effective but just a 50% reduction pays for the wall over and over and that number goes up with even more reduction and imagine what 90% would save us.

We need to deter the masses so we can fine tune the skills and tech to get the wealthy more cleaver ones going underground or over by air. Yes some use boats and planes and we have the Coast Guard working on the gulf and Pacific Ocean. Yes they use planes and yes we need much better planes for the border patrol to use. But I say we fund the USAF a little more and improve our radar and send a few fighter jets their way and those cartel planes will slow way down. As it is now they simply have better and faster planes then we do.

We are not stating that every immigrant crossing is a criminal with a criminal record or has criminal intentions but they are crossing illegally which by definition makes them a criminal. But take all of those folks trying for a better life and the American dream out of the equation for a moment, we still have, over the past two years, approximately 4,000 criminal aliens that have been arrested for homicide, 30,000 for sex crimes, over a 100,000 for violent assaults that we have caught after crossing the border. Who knows the number we missed! These crimes are against American citizens! In 2018, 17,000 individuals with criminal records were apprehended trying to cross this border, 60,000 inadmissible or illegal immigrants are turned away from our borders every single month. And over the last few weeks 20,000 children were smuggled or trafficked into the United States. This cannot be acceptable to any of us! This is not a manufactured crisis! We need to open our eyes this is real!

Let’s build the wall and have the wall slow this all down by 90% and reform the current immigration system that both parties are happy with to help all the ones wanting a better life and American dream to come across legally.

We need to stop illegal immigration and support legal immigration plain and simple.

[Goofy11]

No disrespect to anyone who is or served in the military but it is an all volunteer military force. Firefighters, police officers, EMT’s, and doctors save lives every day so please don’t act like military men and women are the only occupation that put their lives on the line.

Trump once said that he always wanted a Purple Heart : https://www.politico.com/story/2016/...e-heart-226565

Had he not got 5 deferments and actually served perhaps he could have earned one.

For a non military person telling a military person that he always wanted a Purple Heart is disrespectful. When you earn a Purple Heart normally a severe injury comes with one.

Did you blast trump for making that statement?

Absolutely police, fire, ems, Doc’s and other folks save lives and should be commended. They are however state side and with family. The military men and women who freely volunteer to serve our country in peace and in war do so mostly abroad and over seas away from their family’s missing a number of births, birthdays, anniversaries, their child’s first words, first steps, their first sports outing their parents or family members death and funeral all so we can sleep safely at night. And willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for millions of people they do not even know, for millions of people who protest them and treat the terrible when they return home...

The Purple Heart President Trump was given was given by a military veteran out of pure respect for the president and it was his gift to him. Now yes his words “I always wanted one” would have been better not said but the man was not upset and was honored to give it to him and proudly did so. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zR66EoDQEt0

Now this Purple Heart comment was an absolute disgrace and a complete embarrassment for all military service men and women! https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rus...ple-heart/amp/

[WellEndowed1911]

The wall by itself will not and can not stop every assault that the wealthy cartels will throw at it. Be it tunnels, explosives, elaborate laddering schemes...but it will deter the thousands to tens of thousands who can, and are freely and simply walking across the border. The walls in San Diego and El Paso and a few other places are stopping 90% of illegal crossing. Heck CNN’s Acusta pointed that out just the other day with video showing how well the wall was working. Really couldn’t have said it better myself. Many of the tunnels have been found and stopped and a lot of those tunnels before they were completed. If we can take a huge work load off the border patrol workers from dealing with thousands upon thousands simply walking across they can refocus and seek out the tunnels. Still probably won’t be 100% effective but just a 50% reduction pays for the wall over and over and that number goes up with even more reduction and imagine what 90% would save us.

We need to deter the masses so we can fine tune the skills and tech to get the wealthy more cleaver ones going underground or over by air. Yes some use boats and planes and we have the Coast Guard working on the gulf and Pacific Ocean. Yes they use planes and yes we need much better planes for the border patrol to use. But I say we fund the USAF a little more and improve our radar and send a few fighter jets their way and those cartel planes will slow way down. As it is now they simply have better and faster planes then we do.

We are not stating that every immigrant crossing is a criminal with a criminal record or has criminal intentions but they are crossing illegally which by definition makes them a criminal. But take all of those folks trying for a better life and the American dream out of the equation for a moment, we still have, over the past two years, approximately 4,000 criminal aliens that have been arrested for homicide, 30,000 for sex crimes, over a 100,000 for violent assaults that we have caught after crossing the border. Who knows the number we missed! These crimes are against American citizens! In 2018, 17,000 individuals with criminal records were apprehended trying to cross this border, 60,000 inadmissible or illegal immigrants are turned away from our borders every single month. And over the last few weeks 20,000 children were smuggled or trafficked into the United States. This cannot be acceptable to any of us! This is not a manufactured crisis! We need to open our eyes this is real!

Let’s build the wall and have the wall slow this all down by 90% and reform the current immigration system that both parties are happy with to help all the ones wanting a better life and American dream to come across legally.

We need to stop illegal immigration and support legal immigration plain and simple.

Very well explained
However, interesting that some drug traffickers at El Chapo’s trial stated that they don’t typically smuggle drugs through the opened border parts but use boats, cars, trains, and planes.
https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/01/12/us/...www.cnn.com%2F

Now granted the Sinola Cartel is the largest in Mexico but who knows whether the other cartels use the border.

[Goofy11]

Oh I am sure they have many and multiple ways of moving their product and pretty much unlimited funds to do so as well. But let’s not throw in the towel and accept defeat. Build a physical barrier that will greatly free up the border patrol so that they can then refocus on those many and multiply ways and start slowing those down.

If we give up our kids and their kids and their kids are doomed. Any drug dealer getting our kids or family members hooked on this stuff should have no mercy and be immediately eliminated from this earth and instantly sent to his maker for judgement. We need to make the war on drugs as serious as the we did the war in isis the last 2 years...unmerciful!

I appreciate the CNN links for reference but they hold absolutely zero credibility with me, zip, zero, none.

[WellEndowed1911]

Oh I am sure they have many and multiple ways of moving their product and pretty much unlimited funds to do so as well. But let’s not throw in the towel and accept defeat. Build a physical barrier that will greatly free up the border patrol so that they can then refocus on those many and multiply ways and start slowing those down.

If we give up our kids and their kids and their kids are doomed. Any drug dealer getting our kids or family members hooked on this stuff should have no mercy and be immediately eliminated from this earth and instantly sent to his maker for judgement. We need to make the war on drugs as serious as the we did the war in isis the last 2 years...unmerciful!

I appreciate the CNN links for reference but they hold absolutely zero credibility with me, zip, zero, none.

So I assume you think Fox News is the only honest news station and everything else is fake news ?
Let’s face the facts CNN and MSNBC are both media outlets that lean heavily liberal and Fox News leans heavily conservative so they are all bias.
Now you get to experience what liberals were dealing with 8 years when Obama was in office and listening to Fox News. In 8 years under Obama I recall perhaps 2 times that Fox News painted him in a positive light - that was when Osama got killed and when Obama ordered the hit to take out the somilian pirates.

Goofy sorry to say you and people like Gfejunkie are exactly what’s wrong with this country. And don’t get me wrong there’s liberals who do the same thing - you go to the polls every 2 to 4 years and you only support a candidate who has an R or D besides their name.
For the life of me I don’t understand how someone can be fully liberal or fully conservative. I hear what both candidates say and make my decision based on who I feel is over all the better candidate. I am not a zombie or a sheep and follow one party. I have voted for both republican and democrats in the past.
There’s been a couple of agendas that I supported Trump - the major one being cutting the corporate tax rate, but Trump is quickly showing his lack of experience - he thinks running the country is the same as running a business - and he’s finding out especially with a liberal controlled house that it’s not that easy.
He had better quickly learn the word compromise- plus I think this year his association with Russia will he exposed. Cohen testifies in front of congress soon all this looks bad for trump.

Goofy and Gfejunkie once again let me ask you we are 2 years into Trumps presidency - when is the last time an administration had so many firings/resignations and or indictments with people actually serving prison time ? I don’t know why you can’t see the train wreck happening right In front of your eyes.

[gfejunkie]

The truth of the matter is people like Goofy11 and I (among many others) are able to look at the various issues sans the emotional baggage of a demented visceral hatred for this President.

The people who work the southern border every day 24/7 know what works and what doesn't. As I said earlier in this thread, and was pretty much roundly ignored by everyone, is the US Border Patrol wants a barrier and that's good enough for me.

[Goofy11]

So I assume you think Fox News is the only honest news station and everything else is fake news ?
Let’s face the facts CNN and MSNBC are both media outlets that lean heavily liberal and Fox News leans heavily conservative so they are all bias.
Now you get to experience what liberals were dealing with 8 years when Obama was in office and listening to Fox News. In 8 years under Obama I recall perhaps 2 times that Fox News painted him in a positive light - that was when Osama got killed and when Obama ordered the hit to take out the somilian pirates.

Goofy sorry to say you and people like Gfejunkie are exactly what’s wrong with this country. And don’t get me wrong there’s liberals who do the same thing - you go to the polls every 2 to 4 years and you only support a candidate who has an R or D besides their name.
For the life of me I don’t understand how someone can be fully liberal or fully conservative. I hear what both candidates say and make my decision based on who I feel is over all the better candidate. I am not a zombie or a sheep and follow one party. I have voted for both republican and democrats in the past.
There’s been a couple of agendas that I supported Trump - the major one being cutting the corporate tax rate, but Trump is quickly showing his lack of experience - he thinks running the country is the same as running a business - and he’s finding out especially with a liberal controlled house that it’s not that easy.
He had better quickly learn the word compromise- plus I think this year his association with Russia will he exposed. Cohen testifies in front of congress soon all this looks bad for trump.

Goofy and Gfejunkie once again let me ask you we are 2 years into Trumps presidency - when is the last time an administration had so many firings/resignations and or indictments with people actually serving prison time ? I don’t know why you can’t see the train wreck happening right In front of your eyes.

Wellendowed, I thought we could agree to disagree and still have a friendly discussion on the topic to hear and take in all points of view. Again we all see things differently and believe different things and for sure interpret what we hear and/or read differently. We are not only diverse in culture/s but in thoughts. Open discussions and listening to all sides is how we learn and grow as a person. We may not agree and we may not be able to change the other persons mindset, but we can still talk to each other as friends.

But here you tell gfe and me that we are what’s wrong with this world and only you and others liberals know what is best for us! So I guess you have placed me in the deplorable, 10 toothed smelly Walmart shopper and a homophobic racist haters group as the left liberals always call us? Interesting.

Never did I say I only watch Fox News. You have assumed that. You have no idea what my news sources are. What you do know is CNN has zero credibility with me.

You also have no idea how I vote or how I view a candidate and you simply took a leap calling me and gfe blind sheep that did not know any better and could only follow the zombie like masses leading us to slaughter.

We are all seeing quite clearly how hard it is to attempt to implement what the people who voted for our president is to do when all, and I will repeat ALL of the Democrats obstruct and only say no to everything we the people whom they work for voted to change. President Trump has compromised on many issues... he agreed to that huge Omnibus Bill that was stuffed full of everything the Democrats wanted. He comprised and agreed to provide amnesty to almost all of the dreamers, way more than the Democrats where demanding but what did they do...nothing because that would have been bipartisanship. He has comprised on the wall way too many times and been lied to about it too many times and is no longer willing to compromise over it. He has agreed again to talk and provide amnesty to the dreamers for the wall...where are the Democrats...not talking about it, just saying No and obstructing!

Cohen has been found guilty of mishandeling of funds and is being strong armed into making up a false narrative and becoming a songbird for Meuller. They did the same (illegal tactics) with Flynn and Manaford. Again it is worth repeating it has been 2 years and 30 million dollars with ZERO evidence of Trump Russian collusion. But there are mountains of evidence of Hillary colluding with the Russian with the Fake made up and paid for Dossier and false story to obtain FISA approval to spy on American citizens and a presidential opponent, and it was all approved by the Obama administration and supported and covered up by the ever so corrupt DOJ, FBI and CIA. Hence why there was never any indictments or arrests they were all in on it. They all believed she would win and they could hide it all and the American people would have never known! Thank goodness enough of us blind sheep zombies could see her for what she was!

Yes we can see the train wreck as we have watched it for 8 years and the last 2 with nothing but obstruction and made up falsehoods by the Democrats. The hypocrisy of the democratic leadership is amazing.

This video speaks volumes and clearly should tell you how the left leadership works and has the media working right with them...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4dPcg0oL3xE

I believe I have answered well enough about the firings and/or resignations and indictments in previous posts.

And gfe I was not ignoring your statement I felt it said it all... the border patrol want it and that should be good enough for all of us!

[WellEndowed1911]

The truth of the matter is people like Goofy11 and I (among many others) are able to look at the various issues sans the emotional baggage of a demented visceral hatred for this President.

The people who work the southern border every day 24/7 know what works and what doesn't. As I said earlier in this thread, and was pretty much roundly ignored by everyone, is the US Border Patrol wants a barrier and that's good enough for me.

Did you have the same furor with millions of Americans who didn't want to go bankrupt going to see a doctor? What was a more serious problem the border or Health Care???
But I guess since the President who proposed a revamp of the health care system has a "D" next to his name it was all a bad idea?

Tell me personally how immigration has affected YOU???

[WellEndowed1911]

The truth of the matter is people like Goofy11 and I (among many others) are able to look at the various issues sans the emotional baggage of a demented visceral hatred for this President.

The people who work the southern border every day 24/7 know what works and what doesn't. As I said earlier in this thread, and was pretty much roundly ignored by everyone, is the US Border Patrol wants a barrier and that's good enough for me.

And the people who work in healthcare including myself abd the 100's of thousands of family's who literally had to sell their houses, work 2 to 3 jobs because their insurance denied an operation or medication they needed was very much real too.
gfejunkie save me with that crap you are one sided and 100% republican I have seen your post in the political forum on ECCIE- pleease don't pretend that you are independent or somewhere in the middle. You support ny candidate with an R behind his name, hell Satan himself could run as a republican and you would support his ideas.

Were you this adamant about border control when Obama supported some fashion of border security???

[Precious_b]

The truth of the matter is people like Goofy11 and I (among many others) are able to look at the various issues sans the emotional baggage of a demented visceral hatred for this President.

The people who work the southern border every day 24/7 know what works and what doesn't. As I said earlier in this thread, and was pretty much roundly ignored by everyone, is the US Border Patrol wants a barrier and that's good enough for me.

Got a link to that assessment? I was surprised that Hurd did not support a barrier.

[Goofy11]

Did you have the same furor with millions of Americans who didn't want to go bankrupt going to see a doctor? What was a more serious problem the border or Health Care???
But I guess since the President who proposed a revamp of the health care system has a "D" next to his name it was all a bad idea?

Tell me personally how immigration has affected YOU???

Our health care system needs some work there is no argument to that but a single payer government healthcare is not affordable and does not provide the best health care. And yes I absolutely had the same furor when Obama Care was unconstitutionally being forced down our thoats and we were forced, by law, to purchase and pay into this albatross of a system that utterly failed in just a few years!

I watched and listened to the president looking into the camera and promise me and every American that we could keep our plans and our doctors. That it would save each American $2500 and insurance costs would continue to be low saving money! Boy did he say that lie with a straight face. Pelosi said we had to pass the albatross of a bill before we could know what was in it! Businesses could not afford it and had to drop health care benefits for their employees who then could not afford their health care needs and many were forced into bankruptcy and had to sell their homes. And I absolutely felt the furor when the republicans compromised and accepted those lies and agreed to the bill.

As stated before I really thought the precondition clause and the ability to carry your kids until 26 were really good...but not much else of it was good for us. I am sure it made several of his supporters rich beyond words. And if everyone has noticed all republicans have stated many times over they will keep the precondition clause and child age in any healthcare reform package. Health care insurance needs to be competitive to keep the price low.

My son was in middle school talking about becoming a medical doctor when this was all playing out...he knew then it was not a good plan and changed his college and career path. So even our kids could see it was a bad plan.

Our focus needs to be on cleaning up Medicare and Medicaid fraud, funding county hospitals better, developing and funding community clinics, stopping illegal immigration in order to provide the needed health care of our homeless and those who don’t have health care, and for those that do not want health care.

And pretty much at the same time Obama was forcing his health care on us, he was in support of stopping illegal immigration and increasing the safety on the southern border and building a physical barrier...

Why does illegal immigration have to personally affect me, or you, or someone in our inner circle before it should be an issue? If it is just affecting 1 or 2 other people it should be a concern for us. But without question if it is affecting over 100,000 Americans it is an issue and not a manufactured issue, it is real. Remember just in the the past two years there have been approximately 4,000 criminal aliens that have been arrested for homicide, that is murder of American citizens. Because it did not personally affect me, are you saying I should not be concerned? There have been 30,000 arrested for sex crimes! Our mothers and daughters and sisters are being raped and sexually assaulted here! Should that not effect me since it was not my daughter or mother or sister? We have also had over 100,000 violent assaults against American citizens...we should all be very concerned about this crisis! We are allowing this to happen because we do not have proper nor enough security on our southern border and the current house leadership is only against it because the current president is named Trump and has an R next to his name. That is simply political obstruction.

But again I feel your question of “has this personally affected you” should be asked to anyone of these families.
http://www.ojjpac.org/memorial.asp

But you commented this in a past post “Also, your clips of people who got killed by illegal immigrants is irrelevant“. Just how is it irrelevant to all of these people that their loved ones were killed by illegal immigrants. Whom many have been arrested for past crimes and released, deported and allowed to sneak back in, in custody but protected and released by a sanctuary city...just how is that irrelevant! We all should be outraged that we are not doing everything we can to protect our actual neighbors.

[Goofy11]

Were you this adamant about border control when Obama supported some fashion of border security???

Yes I supported border control when Obama, Biden, Hillary, Schumer and Pelosi and every other Democrat all supported it for the same exact reasons that president Trump is wanting to increase our border security. And actually they all voted yes and spent a lot more money then is being asked for now...uhm that is an interesting fact.

[WellEndowed1911]

Yes I supported border control when Obama, Biden, Hillary, Schumer and Pelosi and every other Democrat all supported it for the same exact reasons that president Trump is wanting to increase our border security. And actually they all voted yes and spent a lot more money then is being asked for now...uhm that is an interesting fact.

Here are several politicians from both parties who oppose Trump’s version of a wall including Hurd whose state he represents has the longest border.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...anada-46815569

To sum it up most of the politicians said that a higher wall will only delay immigrants by a few minutes or so. If immigrants can currently go over the wall now with a ladder - what makes you think they would bring a taller ladder ?
The politicians mentioned that instead of investing in just a physical wall the U.S should invest in drones and thermal sensors which to me makes more sense.

[Goofy11]

I am in full support of using drones and thermal sensors in addition to a wall as that would for sure increase its effectiveness!

It is possible it might only delay them and they might be able to use taller ladders...but with added drones and thermal sensors to the wall that delay might be all that we need.

I believe Jim Acosta said it very well “I do not see any migrants rushing towards the fence, it is very tranquil here at the wall.”

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=th-oXosPN2M

Wellendowed, I have thoroughly enjoyed the discussions finding them engaging and for the most part friendly. It does seem apparent that you and I and a few others are each on opposite sides of a wall, but that is ok. I am sure we will have other topics for discussion.

Play safe

[gfejunkie]

The people who work the southern border every day 24/7 know what works and what doesn't. As I said earlier in this thread, and was pretty much roundly ignored by everyone, is the US Border Patrol wants a barrier and that's good enough for me.

Got a link to that assessment?

https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2018...6061544661131/


"We need the ability to impede and deny and that is what a barrier brings for us."